My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

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My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  rtcvb32 on Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:26 am

Well I'm a fan of this game, no doubt, had I known of it during the kick-starter I'd have dropped at hundred for it. Also I've reposted this from the one I started at GoG, but here it might get better attention...

So in case I'm totally ignorant since I haven't finished the game (currently searching for Silipso), I'll apologize.

Now a number of my comments are going to be inspired from Freefall and Operation: Inner Space. The comic is based on terra-forming a planet, however while the human inhabitants is about 50,000, there are some 400 million sentient machines helping in the project.



And to the features:

I don't see any actual wild-life present, yes it's in space but that doesn't mean a sentient AI didn't go on a rampage and then replicate itself a thousand times making a swarm and claiming an area. In Freefall something similar happens where toasters go rabid and will attack robots to drain them of energy. Yeah it's not totally logical in one aspect.

In Operation: Inner Space there a mini drone called an interceptor which look like the classic asteroids ship from Atari. You could acquire these and they would spin around you and attack anyone who attacks you. Now if you have interceptors, probes, drones (or anything like that) they need an adjustable AI to try and match your needs and play style. This is not going to be the same as the turrets you drop that have only one job (heal, attack, slow). While those you would actively drop, THESE instead you would generate and they could act based on the AI. Think 'bee hive'.

If a simple programming language could be included this could be akin to C-Robots (and could be it's own mini games). If this isn't feasible then programmed equipment similar to the ships could be added on to give them particular behaviors. (Forth (used in GRobots I think) is also an option as it's more universal behavior rather than optimizing code from CPU cycles)


Now the AI can also be applied to the above mentioned wildlife (or flying toasters if it comes to that). This would likely be similar to building a ship. They could once programmed: Gather, attack, defend, push/pull/throw items (if several are working together they can chain-throw objects in a path to get things from A to B), act as shields/flares (sacrificing themselves to stop missiles from hitting you), act as a beacon (attach to stealthed ships and mark themselves a hostile target), attach to an opponent with and drain/damage or give energy/heat/shields, act as shields etc. If you program in morale they can have rules of when to run away (hurt or minimum numbers), relay commands (calling for help or to stay away), have preferences of numbers/pack, personal space, flanking strategies, etc.

Ah yes, I'd also want to see a ScreenSaver. By this I'm meaning either some missions being played out by the AI, watching SDL fights, lore of the universe, suggested strategies, or perhaps replays of exceptional missions (Like ones you got all the achievements on), commentary from the devs and authors. OR drop everything game related and just make the universe backgrounds run for 5 minutes at a time with spinning planets, shooting stars, flare from nearby stars, shadows as a large star's light is covered for several moments, just a bunch of space exploration type of stuff, preferably it will keep you occupied enough you may just want to watch the screensaver.
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  Paul Dryere on Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:07 pm

Hi and welcome to the forums rtcvb32.  cheers 

While there is no "wild life", there are several sentient species with their own cultures represented in the game. There are references to creatures that live in space, but they weren't added to the game due to time and budget constraints.

There are a few missions where Nero can pilot ships that you put into your auxiliary bays. You can build any ship you would like and watch him pilot it. You can also use Forked Path in the Dimensional Array to make clones of yourself that will have AI pilots.

While compelling, we decided against custom equipment because it would be very hard to balance in a game like Ring Runner. We had initially hoped that the multiplayer component would have seen more play, and so designed a bit around it.

In scenarios like SDL, you can issue basic commands to the AI, F1-F4 on the keyboard.

If you want to watch AI fight each other, you can stay a spectator in SDL or Spire Battle versus multiplayer matches.  Smile 

Thanks for all the feedback!
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  rtcvb32 on Sat Mar 01, 2014 5:54 pm

Paul Dryere wrote:While there is no "wild life", there are several sentient species with their own cultures represented in the game. There are references to creatures that live in space, but they weren't added to the game due to time and budget constraints.

Yeah I've read a few references to 'Space Sharks', and of course in the BEVO mission which is suppose to be an animal (based on a rhino or elephant?).

I'll guess you have time now. As for budget I can only guess. If you started up a KickStarter (or a 'donate' button) for a DLC/expansion of this game I'd support it.

Paul Dryere wrote:There are a few missions where Nero can pilot ships that you put into your auxiliary bays. You can build any ship you would like and watch him pilot it. You can also use Forked Path in the Dimensional Array to make clones of yourself that will have AI pilots.

Interesting, however clones or AI pilots isn't quite what I had in mind. Yes there are a few missions where you're the carrier and are are limited only to guns, but that doesn't really give the ships personalities and behaviors beyond selected equipment/archetypes. I was hoping for something more interactive...

Have you ever used CRobots? Well if allowed to program the AI you can give them very fun and unique behavior. Having them dance around your ship following the points of a star, clumping together, or trying to stay as evenly distanced from eachother as possible (possibly getting into fights among themselves). Likely there could be multiple AI's for the same type (allowing leader/followers). Honestly I'd want to be able to SEE and track the behavior that I added in. I know there's few enough programmers who could take full advantage of this. Of course with CRobots you could also tell the program to do 100,000 fights vs opponents and have it give you the results so you'd know how effective it was against a different AI for fine-tuning.

As for the actual interceptors I imagine them half the size of one of your life pods (mass of 5 or less?). Now being so small they would likely have their own equipment/hull and research blocks just for them. Some could have threaded cores, while others would siphon off of their owner or allies (you could even make one that only generates energy for the others to siphon off of). Ones that run out of energy become inert, so anyone who deals with them could salvage them (temporarily going past their normal limit maybe?) But there would be far more interesting things you could program them to do.

Paul Dryere wrote:While compelling, we decided against custom equipment because it would be very hard to balance in a game like Ring Runner. We had initially hoped that the multiplayer component would have seen more play, and so designed a bit around it.

My post didn't include much for custom equipment, mostly a custom programmable AI. I understand balancing would be impossible if anyone could throw in untested equipment.

I think you're confusing what I meant for the alternative being pseudo equipment for the interceptors (which doesn't actually change the stats/abilities of the ship).

Hmmm Actually this reminds me now of another option; Have you ever played FF12? In FF12 they incorporated Gambits which is a list of orders based on priority and rules, first one met (from the top) matching a rule was used, and it quite often would jump up if the new rules qualified. This gave a lot of flexibility; you could give them utterly useless instructions, but you had to try hard for that.

Paul Dryere wrote:In scenarios like SDL, you can issue basic commands to the AI, F1-F4 on the keyboard.

If you want to watch AI fight each other, you can stay a spectator in SDL or Spire Battle versus multiplayer matches.  Smile 

Thanks for all the feedback!

Maybe, but that assumes you want the game running all the time or having to activate it while having it run on it's own as a screensaver, it could make it's own decisions of what to show.
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  Paul Dryere on Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:45 pm

Adding in user programmable AI would be a considerable overhaul of the current AI system unfortunately. We are currently working on our next project so I don't have that much time to devote to Ring Runner (we did biweekly updates for half a year after release). Our next game does have a heavy focus on users creating custom content. And while it won't let you get into the nitty gritty of AI programming, it will allow setting general personalities and behaviors.

Interestingly enough, the AI in Ring Runner is somewhat similar to the gambit system in FF12. Though the internal logic is many times more complex as it has to account for many more conditions.
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  rtcvb32 on Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:10 am

Awww Sad Perhaps you'll come back to this game gain later, maybe as RR2?

I look forward to seeing what new titles you will put out.
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

Post  rtcvb32 on Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:29 am

Well here's some other requests that might not require a huge overhaul:

I mentioned via email having an alias you could attach to key bindings, this way if you get non XBox controllers or something to work later down the line, the buttons actually would make sense, so instead of number 7, or B (when it means square), having it use those alternate names would be nice. Most buttons can be named with 3 characters or less, and symbols should be supported too (Or perhaps if it's available via Unicode and the font).

Immediately following the mission where I got the F5-Mercury I accidentally loaded over it with the 'balanced' set losing the configuration it originally came with. Trying to re-fill in that is a pain. Other ships come with a 'starter' configuration so probably add the F5-Mercury and any other ones you gain that don't have a quick 'starter' one.

Also regarding configuration... I'd like to be able to load a configuration from a mission or a prebuilt ship as a template. Naturally equipment not bought/available would be removed leaving you blanks to fill in at the hanger.

As I'm thinking about this, I'd like to bind multiple abilities to a single key. By this I mean instead of having to press/mash or hold down multiple buttons, weapons assigned to the binding fire as soon as they are able.
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Random Campaign?

Post  rtcvb32 on Sun Mar 02, 2014 4:24 pm

Ah yes, another feature request perhaps is a random campaign. This would mostly be to liven up the game if you don't want to replay the single-player campaign. But I'm not expecting this.

By this I'm meaning it sorta takes on various aspects of the single-player campaign and incorporates different elements as side missions you can pick up and do for extra plex. Probably have a similar feel to 'spooking the natives' random bonus objectives, etc. Should be diverse enough you can experiment with most archetypes. Hmmm...

based on shadowrun:
This is sorta brought on as I'm thinking of the ShadowRun game for the Genesis, one of the main things you ended up doing was you needed money so you got work from a Mr Johnson, who gave you various random tasks. Take package from A to B, kill ghouls, hack Y computer and bring back X data, act as a body-guard, etc.
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Re: My list of ideas/features i'd want to see...

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